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 Forum index » DIY Hardware and Software » Thomas Henry designs
SN VOICE questions..how to fit on panel!
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loss1234



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 8:11 am    Post subject: SN VOICE questions..how to fit on panel! Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

hey there.... i dont have quite enough room for every function on the sn voice...i might need to cut down to around 8 pots...what can i cut out?

are there are any non-essential jacks or pots?

thanks

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numbernone



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

get a bigger Panel Very Happy

Or squeeze your layout down. within 5 mins of power up you will wish you hadnt left out X.

But I should shut up, cuz I still have 2 SNs to build! Embarassed
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loss1234



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

sorry i am almost done with the panel...i dont have the real estate or money right now for bigger panels...and i dont think i am going to use every single jack and knob always...what i might do is add a multiple/556 mixer mod like someone else did and put it on a 1 wide panel...frac sure is small!!
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fluxmonkey



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

have you looked at fonik's euro version: http://www.modular.fonik.de/Page23.html ? elegant as usual, i've lifted a couple of his euro designs straight to frac.

b
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fonik



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bbob wrote:
have you looked at fonik's euro version: http://www.modular.fonik.de/Page23.html ? elegant as usual, i've lifted a couple of his euro designs straight to frac.

b

ooops, that was a reminder! the SN voice is finished for months! i will update the site and upload the fpd-file.

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v-un-v
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Dan, have you tried using a drafting program like QCad for knocking up some front panel designs? QCad doesn't cost much, and it's a lot easier to use than FPD. Failing that there is Cenon (I don't know what computer you use, but Cenon only works on Linux and Mac OS).

It could help you design your panels.

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IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
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loss1234



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

thanks v-un-v i will check into that

beats eyeing it i am sure

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v-un-v
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The thing with QCad, Dan, is that it is a proper CAD drafting program (it looks very much like autocad btw, but is much easier to use). As it is a proper drafting program, when you specify a 10mm radius circle, the final dxf file will have a circle with a radius of 10mm (as long as you keep the scale at 1:1 of course!)
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DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN.
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Luka



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

ill check out cenon
thanks for the tip v

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Unkie Al



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 9:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Idea Very Happy Idea Howzabout stacked concentric pots? Two separate pots, one common axis.
http://static.zoovy.com/img/guitarelectronics/W180-H180-Bffffff/newstacked_500x500.jpg
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Photon



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I was able to fit all onto a frac format panel. I'll try to remember and take a picture when I get home tonight.

p.
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Tim Servo



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:18 pm    Post subject: SN VOICE questions..how to fit on panel! Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Unkie Al wrote:
Idea Very Happy Idea Howzabout stacked concentric pots? Two separate pots, one common axis.
http://static.zoovy.com/img/guitarelectronics/W180-H180-Bffffff/newstacked_500x500.jpg


Concentric pots are a great space saver (look at the Oberheim SEM), but they're expensive and can be difficult to find in the right values. Also, the knobs tend to be more expensive too.

Tim (tends to be cheaper) Servo
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loss1234



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

photon-id love to see that picture....looks like for now i am using a 2 wide and a 1 wide together to make a 3 wide panel to fit everything on...

pots-


i dont get how to use concentric pots for the sn...when you turn the knob it turns both pots right? so how can i apply that? i cant think of any parameters on the sn voice that would fit that...that id want to have turned at the same value all the time....

i did use them in a filter i built this summer though

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EdisonRex
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

concentric pots don't have to turn at the same time. I remember them well on a Soundcraft mixer I used in the 80s when I was doing sound for bands a lot. The mixer had an arrangement where the outer ring was the frequency for the EQ and the inner was the amplitude. It worked very well.
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Danno Gee Ray



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

On older car radios, the outer ring would be tone or balance while the inner would be volume. Independantly adjustable, knid of like one stacked on top of the other.
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Photon



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Heres the panel. crap photo (sorry my camera is a toy), but I think you get the idea. The pcb isn't wired to the panel yet bec. I haven't figured out how to wire the on-on-on switches to work as 3-way selectors (paging Mr. Herrmann...) as seen on Foniks' SNV.

hope this gives you some ideas.
Peter


SNvoice rev2.jpg
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goldenechos



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Photon wrote:
I haven't figured out how to wire the on-on-on switches to work as 3-way selectors (paging Mr. Herrmann...) as seen on Foniks' SNV.
Peter


Here's how to do it with a 7211. Not sre what type switch you are using. I have also used this wiring schematic with Hong Super Seller on-on-on switches.

Tony


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Photon



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks Tony!
I sure appreciate it.

Peter
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goldenechos



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

numbernone wrote:
get a bigger Panel Very Happy

Or squeeze your layout down. within 5 mins of power up you will wish you hadnt left out X.


I have to say that I disagree.
I think the SN-Voice features are a bit exhaustive. The module is designed to be a complete synthesizer voice. More then many of us need as we already have working systems, monosynths, samplers etc...

I am not saying that having a complete voice is a bad thing...
But sometimes you need to look at the space and time with reference to the BANG.

The best thing about the SN-Voice is the Noise source imho. It is very unique sounding., and combined with Thomas' cool CV circuit it is very useful... to me.

I also feel that TH left out many things that interest me abot the SN chip. SO I added those things (all mixing and triggering logic is wired to the fron panel for VC or manual control). This is where the oscillator shines. As a AM source for the triggering section, or mixed with the noise using that screwy logic controlled mixing section.

WHen I build another SN-Voice (I have 4 boards left). I will probably not utilize all the features. I could do without Linear FM, AC-DC coupling, Triangle Out... perhaps just a single CV input with attenuator for both the OSC. and the Noisen (one each).

Tony
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fonik



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Photon wrote:
I haven't figured out how to wire the on-on-on switches to work as 3-way selectors (paging Mr. Herrmann...) as seen on Foniks' SNV.


from my site, too (partly german though):

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

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Photon



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks Fonik.
It wasn't the German that was confusing. I didn't understand your diagram.

-peter

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bambam



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Has anyone figured out how to use a 7211 switch to select VCO or Noise or a mix of both. I have been trying and trying but so far i have VCO or Noise or LFO Sad
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Adam-V



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I don't think you need to waste a 7211 switch on this.

The logic for selection of noise/VCO/both is as follows:
Code:

         SN76477 Pins
Output    25  26  27
Noise     1   0   0
Pulse     0   0   0
mixed     1   1   0


You only need a 3 position switch (on-off-on) to get the three required logic levels at the SN chip.

Check the following diagrams for switch wiring and simple logic gate circuit required to perform the translation. Points A and B correspond to each other on both diagrams.

When the switch is up, A is Low, B is High. This translates to pin 25 being high, and pins 26 & 276 being low so noise is selected.
When the switch is in the centre, Both A & B are high. This translates to pins 25, 26 and 27 being low so Pulse is selected.
When the switch is down, A is High and B is Low. This translates to pins 25 & 26 being high and pin 27 being low so both noise and pulse are selected.

Looking at it in truth table form:
Code:

   Switch    SN76477
             2  2  2
    A  B     5  6  7
  +-----------------
U | 0  1 =>  1  0  0
C | 1  1 =>  0  0  0
D | 1  0 =>  1  1  0


Which means:
Pin 25 = A NAND B
Pin 26 = ! B
Pin 27 = A NOR B


Single Switch Tri Logic Digram.GIF
 Description:
Obtaining 2 logic lines from a single 3 pos switch.
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Single Switch Tri Logic Digram.GIF



SN-Voice Mix Logic.GIF
 Description:
Logic for converting to SN noise/vco/mix select.
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SN-Voice Mix Logic.GIF



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Adam-V



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Actually, since pin 27 is always low for selection of noise/pulse or mix you don't even need to be that complex.

The attached hastily put together diagram shows wiring for a standard DPDT on-off-on switch which will give you selection of noise, mix or pulse.

Assuming pin 27 is tied to ground.

In the up position, pin 25 is held high, 26 is held low. (Noise is selected)
In the centre position, pins 25 and 26 are held high. (Mix is selected)
in the down position, Pins 25 and 26 are held low. (Pulse is selected)

Cheers,
Adam-V


SNV-DPDT-Mix-Select.GIF
 Description:
SNV Output select with a single DPDT Centre off switch (on-off-on)
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SNV-DPDT-Mix-Select.GIF



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loss1234



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

PHOTON

hoW MANY u WIDE IS YOUR FRAC PANEL?


4 wide? 5 wide?

thanks.

it looks like a great layout

the reason i ask is i am trying to come up with some kind of standard for my frac panels (how many pots i can fit on average on a single or double u panel)

thanks

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