Jazzmutant Lemur

EdisonRex

I searched before I posted this, and I know it's OSC, technically, not MIDI, although it does MIDI, but I'd like to hear from anyone who has had any real time with a Lemur.

I'm fascinated with the concept, but the 3 grand kind of makes me not want to waste money, if you know what I mean.

I don't know of anything like it, except the Dexter, of course, but perhaps someone can illuminate me (us) on the product. If this has been reviewed here, I missed it. By all means, point some internal linkage here if you remember better than the search function.

I'm fantasizing about using it with Max/MSP, of course, but also I'd probably be working on some other toys in OSC, since it seems like an interesting direction. Yeah, I've read Cycling74, so don't point there, thanks.

ar2jr · Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:02 am Post subject:

it's just brilliant. an absolute joy. as difficult as you want to make it Smile

Kassen · Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:41 am Post subject:

ar2jr · Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:43 am Post subject:

i don't think that you can use osc to remove objects but you can definitely manipulate the objects. the patches we were working on for M.I.A were based on this but not even through OSC (it was A.Live and midi cc lines being graphically represented on the lemur).

-matia

ar2jr · Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:48 am Post subject:

as far as specifying its osc behavior, I don't have a personal lemur right in front of me (use the studio's) and most of the fun stuff for me is the ability to mess with analog modular's with the Lemur (so it's just midi messages), but, just like setting up MIDI parameters within the software, (which is in the sidebar) there is a section for osc parameter definition per object.

-matia

ar2jr · Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:51 am Post subject:

sorry, but, for the most part, you have to have the software editor running. and yes, as far as I know its OSX and Windows.

-matia

Kassen · Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 5:02 am Post subject:

Oh, that's a bit of a missed chance then. I'd say that if you have a Ethernet port anyway it would make most sense to do all editing over OSC as well. That way by simply publishing the spec it would be compatible with any conceivable platform and completely future-proof for the next decades.

I asked about that because there is a current debate on the ChucK list about abstracting GUI elements to OSC and it'd be nice if defining a fader would also make it appear on a device like the Lemur but sadly that won't fly then.

Oh, well. For controlling modulars it still looks lovely.

ar2jr · Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 11:42 am Post subject:

it has it limits, but just the concept of an open architecture (mostly) environment for control is great. i think it has a lot of strengths in the live arena because everything is so clearly labeled on the thing and can adapt to pretty much any environment. i also think that it will become more 'malleable' as things progress.

-matia

Picture 1.png

Description:

to be able to very clearly organize stuff is priceless in certain situations

Filesize:

191.85 KB

Viewed:

324 Time(s)

This image has been reduced to fit the page. Click on it to enlarge.

BobTheDog · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:55 am Post subject:

Hi Guys,

You can dynamically change what the Lemur is displaying, it is pretty easy to do this. I have code if anyone is interested.

Cheers

Andy

Kassen · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:25 am Post subject:

I don't need the code (right now, at least...) but I'd love a outline of the kind of approach used.

Matia, I agree. I think it's quite odd how often the same interface used for creating the instrument is supposed to be good for playing it. The Lemur makes a clearer distinction there which sounds like a great idea to me. Not to mention it gets 'round that annoying mouse.

BobTheDog · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:07 am Post subject:

Well basically you use the same XML based network protocol that the editor uses.

Each page on the Lemur is called an interface, this interface then contains controls. Here is some XML (lemur talk JZML) that describes an interface with a knob and a fader:

BobTheDog · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:12 am Post subject:

the XML in the previous post is not displayed correctly, but you get the idea.

Kassen · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:20 am Post subject:

Got it. That does sound quite workable (aside from the plugin wrapper). Very interesting, if only they weren't so expensive...

As for the code; did you disable HTML and smileys? I think the only thing the code tag does is prevent the forum from destroying all indentation.

BobTheDog · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:26 am Post subject:

Disabled html and smileys., still the same.

Kassen · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:39 am Post subject:

Kassen · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:40 am Post subject:

Anyway, I still get the picture so all is fine. :¬)

BobTheDog · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 5:24 am Post subject:

Got it in, you need a wide screen though!

I will edit the profile, thanks for the info

Andy

Kassen · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 6:26 am Post subject:

It's not so bad, you just have to know all these annoying little settings.

This XML looks quite straightforward, I wouldn't like to write it by hand but implementing it doesn't seem like a huge deal.

BobTheDog · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 6:40 am Post subject:

Yea its not too bad.

There is a lot of power to be had out of the Lemur but currently you really need processing on the host to really make it shine.

What I love about it is that it makes bits of software with lots of fiddly controls into tactile musical instruments, some of the reaktor ensembles I have had for years and never used because they just looked too complicated and difficult to use suddenly have become absolute gems.

There is talk of the next software update having a scripting type language running on the Lemur, this would be fantastic.

Another project I have in mind is the "ultimate" sequencer, basically running on the computer with the Lemur as the controller. If only there was more time!

Cheers

Andy

Kassen · Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:29 am Post subject:

Sure, but then what controller doesn't need processing on the host? BTW; Sequencers, in my experience, are really easy to make, it's the interface what matters (and that's hard...). I suppose that holds for synths as well, on my other schreen I'm playing with a really simple synth (just a square osc, a filter and a envelope) but with a joypad to control it it's loads of fun and actually starting to sound good because expressive playing is easy.

MathHat · Joined: May 29, 2008 Posts: 13 Location: SLC

Has anyone experimented with various keyboard layouts (piano, wicki, janko) on the Lemur? How responsive is it, and is it awkward to plink out a melody on a touch screen?

BobTheDog · Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 4:43 pm Post subject:

There is too much latency for my liking, it is about 20 ms at the best. If there is a lot of network traffic it gets worse.

Cheers

Andy

bbinkovitz · Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 6:52 pm Post subject:

smokris and I have one but we haven't used it yet. I'm currently trying to figure out how to get it to work with Ableton Live. In fact I think I'll go post a thread for some help!

GaryRea

BobTheDog · Posted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 1:43 pm Post subject:

Hi,

If you mean live performance use when you say realtime then this is not correct, the lemur is a very powerful controller for whatever you want to use it for.

The use of OSC "Open Sound Control" in the lemur means that it can talk to any OSC compliant server, whatever this may be.

One example how I use it is to set up templates to send keyboard commands to applications via Osculator, another is to set up powerful control sets for controlling synths, another is to control DAWs etc etc.

Now at version 2 the lemur contains its own scripting language so now you don't need external processing that used to be done with Max, Reaktor, Bidule or a custom written OSC server.

All in all it is an extremely powerful device and its multi-touch.

Cheers

Andy