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Digital Reverb PT2399, 6 delays modules.
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AnalogCustom



Joined: Jun 23, 2009
Posts: 51
Location: Chile

PostPosted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:02 am    Post subject: Digital Reverb PT2399, 6 delays modules.
Subject description: MN3011 BBD multitap emulation.
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*ORIGINAL LINK, SPANISH, Updated with 6 modules*
http://sites.google.com/site/analogcustomkits/Home/reverb-digital


This is my digital reverb project. It consists of 5 echo modules connected in parallel.

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.


The modules (x 5 o more)
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

Demos:

http://www.goear.com/listen/9ecfa8a/Demo-Reverb-
http://www.goear.com/listen/9a42ad1/Reverb-2-

initial: Dry + feedback = 0 ---- feedback from minimum to maximum (from long delay) ----- silence ----- Feedback 75% from medium delay.
http://www.goear.com/listen/16548ad/Demo-Reverb-3-AnalogCustom

Soon upload the information

Sorry, I do not speak English.

Regards from Chile.

ACS.

Last edited by AnalogCustom on Fri Sep 25, 2009 7:56 pm; edited 4 times in total
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TekniK



Joined: Aug 10, 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

It sounds realy great mate!
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Tim Servo



Joined: Jul 16, 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 8:22 pm    Post subject: Digital Reverb PT2399, 5 delays... Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Nice work! I like the method of using multiple echo units for a reverb effect. Looking forward to seeing more info. Smile

Tim (only one unit) Servo
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Uncle Krunkus
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 10:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Digital Reverb PT2399, 5 delays... Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Tim Servo wrote:
I like the method of using multiple echo units for a reverb effect.


Yes, I'd like to do something similar using 2 * MN3011s. In the analogue domain, I think it's really the way to go. Reverb is, afterall, a set of varying delays interacting with each other.

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Luka



Joined: Jun 29, 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

sounds great
pls i would love to hear more

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diablojoy



Joined: Sep 07, 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 2:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

does sound very good
looking forward to hearing more
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Uncle Krunkus
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 3:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

What are the 5 delay settings? Roughly?
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iorobyy



Joined: Sep 26, 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 3:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sound very good! Shocked , the pcbs look like 5 geofx - pt2399 echoes , it's correct?
The project is very interesting...
more infomations needed soon please!! Very Happy
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AnalogCustom



Joined: Jun 23, 2009
Posts: 51
Location: Chile

PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 6:38 pm    Post subject: Digital Reverb PT2399, 6 delays... Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Spanish Version. English version soon.
(los acentos ortograficos son omitidos a proposito)
*********************************************************
Este proyecto lo cree basandome en 2 proyectos de Reverb Analogica de Maplin (ETI). Mi objetivo fue emular las características del MN3011, "3328-Stage BBD with 6 Taps". El pcb lo hice basado en el diseño de geofex, R.G. Keen, pero tiene varias modificaciones.

Mi objetivo no es crear una reverb de alta fidelidad. Mi idea es crear una reverb con un sonido especial, con un caracter sonoro poco comun.

El proyecto definitivo es con 6 modulos.
Acá una muestra de audio con 6 modulos y "variable delay time" (long delay):
http://www.goear.com/listen/a5298a2/Reverb-6-modules-AnalogCustom

Los tiempos de delay los escogi de manera arbitraria en base al datasheet del PT2399 y buscando tiempos semejantes al MN3011. En teoria estos no deben ser multiplos en entre si (ver el proyecto ETI reverb o el datasheet del MN3011).

El esquema base de cada modulo es el siguente:

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

El PCB de cada modulo:

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.


Como es complejo medir el clock del PT para ajustar los tiempos, decidi que la mejor opción es medir el voltaje en el pin de cada modulo denominado "TIME" en el pcb (TIME DELAY). Este voltaje lo obtuve luego de ajustar la resistencia de cada trimmer segun los valores que indicaba el datasheet respecto a cada tiempo de delay. Para tener un control extra del sonido decidi hacer ajustable el ultimo modulo, el del delay más largo. Toda esta información podran encontrarla en el archivo pdf adjunto.

http://sites.google.com/site/analogcustomkits/pt2399-digital-delay-project-part-1/PT2399%2CDigitalReverbProject.pdf


Acá una muestra con "variable time delay (long delay, 5 modules)":

http://www.goear.com/listen/dfce5c1/Digital-Reverb-PT2399-w-variable-Time-Delay-AnalogCustom

La mezcla de cada modulo NO es igual. Es desde mayor ganancia (delay corto) hasta menor ganacia (delay largo), semejante al proyecto de "ETI reverb".

Todas las opiniones y sugerencias seran muy bien recibidas.

Pronto la segunda parte: Main PCB...


AnalogCustomSynth

Last edited by AnalogCustom on Tue Aug 25, 2009 7:50 am; edited 2 times in total
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SineSurfer



Joined: Jan 19, 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hola Marco y bienvenido!

very interesting/muy interesante!

the BSS synth looks cool too Wink

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fluxmonkey



Joined: Jun 24, 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

googlish translation: http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.electro-music.com%2Fforum%2Fviewtopic.php%3Ft%3D35276%26sid%3D30ed29fbc099ca6974031c436d2b76aa&sl=es&tl=en&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

nice job!

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AnalogCustom



Joined: Jun 23, 2009
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 9:53 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thank you very much !!!

There is an error in the calculation of time. Failed to add the resistance of 1k of each module. An engineer friend helped me in the calculations. The correct time calculated by Lagrange Interpolation:

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

The example of audio with 6 modules was done with the times.

The MN3011 times, according to the following table (datasheet):

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.


The minimum delay time to delivery of the datasheet PT2399 is 31.3 msec. Calculating by the method of Lagrange interpolation values to emulate the MN3011 are:

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

The correct word is "trimmer." Sorry...


Cordiales Saludos!!!

Marco.

Last edited by AnalogCustom on Fri Sep 25, 2009 7:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Uncle Krunkus
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I'm thinking about doing a similar (module based) project using MN3205 BBDs.
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AnalogCustom



Joined: Jun 23, 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Uncle Krunkus wrote:
I'm thinking about doing a similar (module based) project using MN3205 BBDs.


Genial! Great!!!
So we can exchange ideas. I have some ideas for the motherboard such as a stereo mix of the echoes, CV time, CV decay (VCA for feedback), CV amount (VCA for effect level), etc...

Here a block diagram of a Maplin project:

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

I have the schematics in a book. If you need it can be sent to your email.

A sample audio with drum machine (Reverb PT2399, 6 modules):
http://www.goear.com/listen/4f19fff/reverb-PT-drum-AnalogCustom

Marco
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Uncle Krunkus
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Here's a pic of what I'm thinking of doing.
I just need to work out how I can mix the compressed signals.


Delay idea.xls
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iorobyy



Joined: Sep 26, 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

hello!
Could you post the remaining informations of the project, signal mixer, buffers , controls etc., i'm trying to make a single board pcb
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Uncle Krunkus
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I've changed my tack on this slightly.
I'm now going to breadboard just one delay with it's associated level and speed controls, and when I have that running well, I'll incorporate a second delay unit and decide on the mixing/feedback routing. Then add the third delay etc.
I think it will still end up being a number of identical modules connected to a motherboard which will hold the preamp, output summer, PSU, and feedback busses.

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AnalogCustom



Joined: Jun 23, 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 3:42 pm    Post subject: Update... Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Final Panel with new feature: Delay/Reverb Control.

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

Schematics:

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

Demo:









ORIGINAL LINK, SPANISH
(Enlace del proyecto en español):

http://sites.google.com/site/analogcustomkits/Home/reverb-digital





Soon PCB...


Marco Antonio.

Last edited by AnalogCustom on Fri Sep 25, 2009 6:46 pm; edited 3 times in total
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iorobyy



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 2:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Goooood Very Happy ,i'm waiting for this final infos , i'm working on a pcb too , but i have no pt2399 (ordered) for to prototype
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loss1234



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

this is really great

since the MN3011 seems to be impossible to find (anyone know where to find one?) and the PT2399 is a very cheap chip, this gets many ideas going!!!

thanks

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AnalogCustom



Joined: Jun 23, 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hello:
There is a reverb module. Apparently the module works similarly.

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

There are 3 versions: Short, Medium and Long reverb.

You can buy smallbear:
http://www.smallbearelec.com/Detail.bok?no=780


I heard some demos of Belton module and the sound is very similar:
http://www.abbianengineering.com/misc/BeltonCarrier.html

Regards.

Marco Antonio.
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iorobyy



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PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

i've ordered 2 pieces one week ago from small bear , it seem interesting!
more infos here...
http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/pdf/ggg_verb_sc.pdf
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AnalogCustom



Joined: Jun 23, 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

iorobyy wrote:
i've ordered 2 pieces one week ago from small bear , it seem interesting!
more infos here...
http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/pdf/ggg_verb_sc.pdf


Info Patent:

http://www.pat2pdf.org/patents/pat20090003614.pdf

Regards.

Marco.


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Uncle Krunkus
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks heaps for these last two pics.
My MN3205 experiments have led me to a place where I have 3 * 4096 stage BBD delays, and the last piece was to find a tried and tested way of mixing them together. This is just perfect!
I toyed with the idea of building what would be a DimC with long delays and keep a 3205 for a spare, but I think implementing the DimC modulation into this three delay system with cross feedback options will actually produce a more unique unit. Very Happy

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deathfaces



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

are you using two different power supplies for this (5v & 15+-v)? is it possible to use a voltage regulator off the 15+ to power the 5v modules?
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