Computer Generated Music Composition

ProEtContra · Joined: Apr 19, 2008 Posts: 8 Location: Sarajevo

With today's virtual instruments, audio editing programs...there's no limit...
But what's about Composing music, how to create new song/melody/theme...? Composing music with computers is almost norm? Pro Et Contra?

elektro80 · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 12:53 pm Post subject:

Are you thinking of algorithimc composition tools or simply this:
The DAW as a compositional tool ?

ProEtContra · Joined: Apr 19, 2008 Posts: 8 Location: Sarajevo

Algorithmic compositions, composing music with computers

Sam_Zen · Joined: Mar 08, 2008 Posts: 251 Location: NL

Tuning algorithms is a main point indeed.

A few examples :
This one uses fractal algorithms to calculate a composition in MIDI format :
http://www.xs4all.nl/~samzen/download/fmus2000.7z
This one generates soundfiles of a certain duration depending of a graphical bitmap :
http://www.xs4all.nl/~samzen/download/audiopaint.7z

But if you really want to have full control on the composition process while using a computer, better check the tracker format.

Inventor · Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 3:15 am Post subject:

I wrote a program that does algorithmic composition in a fun and creative way. It has a matrix of buttons, 12 wide by 8 tall. You click on the buttons to create some visual pattern or image on the 12x8 pixel array, and then press "play". A musical sequence then begins, playing for about ten minutes. It's a sequencing technique that I call Boolean Sequencing, and it permits the generation of complex sequences from just a few mouse clicks. I enjoy it a lot.

ProEtContra · Joined: Apr 19, 2008 Posts: 8 Location: Sarajevo

First of all i would like to say: obviously I didn't make it clear enough ("Computer Generated Music").
Today's "composing music" is - almost - manipulation by combining and mixing with already exiting loops and patterns.
But, what's about the melody, tune...???
It's not too simple, so, why shouldn't we accept the help of IT?
Probably, you'll be surprised by the amount of software that you will find: Apple Computer's GarageBand software, Classical Music Composer, Easy Music Composer, FlexiMusic Composer, Fractal Music Composer, Jump, Magix Music Maker, Virtual Music Composer,... Yes, all these programs compose new music. And really important notice:
they doesn't require any special knowledge or/and skills of composition. Just click a couple of buttons and listen to the music, new songs. And it belongs to you!...

Inventor

dewdrop_world · Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:13 am Post subject:

While the composition process (or any creative process) can be described in many ways, I think it's especially relevant to this discussion to think of it as a decision-making process. How many millions of decisions go into a piece of music?

Published tools for algorithmic composition blur the lines somewhat. There's no question who made the decisions in Brahms' first piano concerto (not considering interpretive decisions made in preparation for, or during, a performance). A software tool incorporates decisions from the software designer, as well as the user who sets those parameters that the designer made the conscious choice to expose.

So for me, the relevant question is, who is making the decisions? If the programmer made millions of design decisions and the user set a couple dozen parameters, who is really responsible for creating the music? If the user had such a small level of influence over the results, can the user justifiably say "I wrote that"?

Now, a composer who has the skills to design her own compositional algorithms and writes her own software is taking those decisions into her own hands. The software may produce the notes, but it also encodes the author's biases and so its results can be much more reasonably said to belong to the composer.

Some people use algorithmic tools to generate raw material, from which they choose the best ideas and work out the final form by hand. There again, the composer is taking more responsibility for the end result.

James

ProEtContra · Joined: Apr 19, 2008 Posts: 8 Location: Sarajevo

Quite agree. The computer / program / software / machine... cannot replaces the humans. It helps! And it must be used.

Inventor · Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:09 am Post subject:

Hmmm, very thoughtful post, James, makes a lot of sense. I never thought that as a programmer I was pre-planning the compositional act, but I guess I actually did. I chose to restrict the full set of arbitrary logic to a subset with sum of products form and created the matrix user interface. That shapes how the user interacts with the software to create the music. So I guess I played a role in the composition of music that I'll never hear, how strange!

Sam_Zen · Joined: Mar 08, 2008 Posts: 251 Location: NL

Nice discussion here.
Programs can be used to render some sound file. But there is a difference in the decision of choosing some software setting,
and the decision to change that setting on a certain moment.
Because electronic composition is still about a development in time. Producing sounds is no problem, it's about the moments of change.

ProEtContra · Joined: Apr 19, 2008 Posts: 8 Location: Sarajevo

Sam_Zen · Joined: Mar 08, 2008 Posts: 251 Location: NL

My first comment is on the format. I refuse to use anything from the dreadful Real.
So I had to rename 'LvBsX_video.rv' to 'LvBsX_video.rm' to find a player to make something happening.

This soundtrack is quite nice, although the classical music approach is prominent, and the electronic touch
is harder to find.

ProEtContra · Joined: Apr 19, 2008 Posts: 8 Location: Sarajevo

Sam_Zen · Joined: Mar 08, 2008 Posts: 251 Location: NL

Thanks for your efforts.
Since I don't do streaming when reviewing something, only downloads, the .m3u file gave the same problem as the .ram one :
Just a playlist, not the actual file.

The .mov version could be Saved As. (As Real, I don't use Quicktime things either for streaming, or WMP)
Thanks for that one. More compatibility with media-apps. A beautiful video I must say.

elektro80 · Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:21 am Post subject:

.m3u

open it with a text editor and you have the urls

Sam_Zen · Joined: Mar 08, 2008 Posts: 251 Location: NL

I know.

Gongchime · Joined: Apr 29, 2008 Posts: 1 Location: Indonesia

I've been studying how Expert Systems mimic pro composers. I'd really like to see some music composition software which isn't only music sequencing software or music notation/graphing software.

I'd specifically like to see a program that will take a melody I input, perhaps only scanned in, that the computer then runs through all of the traditional music composition transformational devices without making me write them all out and test them on my instrument before I input them into the so called music composition software.

If and when it can instantly create, inversions, retrogrades, retrograde-inversions, permutations, augmentations, diminutions, diatonic transpositions, putting the original melodic series together with the rhythmic retrograde, or putting the melodic series' retrograde inversion with the original melodic rhythm or taking the melodic series from one tune and combining it with the melodic rhythm from another tune, automatically make a diatonic melody pentatonic or automatically change the mode, then and ONLY then will there be any real music composition software in the universe.

ProEtContra · Joined: Apr 19, 2008 Posts: 8 Location: Sarajevo

Inventor

dewdrop_world · Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 1:11 pm Post subject:

One implication, probably unintended, of Gongchime's argument is that the only musical activity that can be called "composition" is that activity which (in part) manipulates notes using "inversions, retrogrades, retrograde-inversions, permutations, augmentations, diminutions, diatonic transpositions" etc.

That seems unnecessarily narrow to me. Certainly arranging notes in a sequencer is composition. Certainly (for example) Squarepusher's complex beat programming is a form of composition. Coding custom algorithms to generate notes (or sonic events that don't fall under the rubric of "notes") as part of a composition is itself compositional activity (though it may not by itself be "composition").

To say "then and ONLY then will there be any real music composition software in the universe" makes a LOT of assumptions about what is... well, what is music. Certainly not everyone will share those assumptions, so I can't see this as a generally valid statement. It may be valid for Gongchime, but for my compositional process, no, it isn't (even though my classical composition training informs my process, that process is not limited to classical techniques).

Besides, Brahms' "developing variation" approach is more interesting to me than note-geometry Razz

James

Inventor · Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 3:05 pm Post subject:

Thoughtful as always, James. Your comments are enjoyable as they are from an enlightened perspective.

Does Gongchime refer to a piece of software that the music community lacks? If so, we could code it up.

And James, while I have you on the line, I'd thought of making a "Best of ChucK" CD for electro-music.com to sell, but the idea fell short. I wonder if a "Best of electro-music.com" CD that included ChucK, Supercollider, and other stuff would be a worthwhile effort for us to pursue? Your perspective?

elektro80 · Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 7:11 pm Post subject:

elektro80 · Last edited by elektro80 on Wed May 21, 2008 8:25 am; edited 1 time in total

mtvic · Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:26 pm Post subject:

Take a look at Notikl by Intermorphic

http://notikl.com/