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DIY Vocoder projects?
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freewave



Joined: Aug 15, 2007
Posts: 8
Location: Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I do belive there was a fix mentioned on page four of this thread. I think the work on that pdf. was owsome and I want to try the project myself. I hope someone will get into this thread and breath some life into this interesting project.

Regards
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Broadwave



Joined: Feb 16, 2007
Posts: 347
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I've almost completed the Okita build, just some hardware wiring and I should be good to go.

I'm afraid I think I may have found another error on the lower right of goodrevdoc's PCB... Cut the trace as shown below (I think this may be why the Op-Amp was getting hot)

The output of pin 1 (IC29) shouldn't be linked to the Instrument gain pot via the jumper... Maybe this is also causing the indicator problems - I'll find out tomorrow, when I can start testing the boards.


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Broadwave



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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

OK, so breaking the track (above) fixes the indicator problem and no hot Op-Amps.

BUT... I've also found another major error on goodrevdoc's component layout - all the 4.7uf and 10uf tant caps around the NE570/571 are the wrong way round.

I'm just about to replace them, so I'll see if that fixes things.

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Broadwave



Joined: Feb 16, 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 11:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Built, tested & finally working Smile

I had to revert to Okita's original schematic, along with the additional 470k resistor modification on pins 1 & 16 to ground of the companders - sorry, but there's just too many errors on goodrevdoc's version Sad

Intelligibility is ok-ish, maybe not quite as good as the SVC-350 which it's based on, but still pretty usable, although I can detect a definite formant shift... maybe I should have used better quality capacitors Embarassed

You need to be careful of both input levels, otherwise it will distort! I found that it helps to roll off the bass end on both input signals. I've got an old chorus pedal somewhere, which I'll install at some point, but the good news is that substituting NE570's with NE571's works fine, and you can get them from Futurlec for a reasonable price.

For this quick test I used a Behringer C1 condenser mic, via my DI Box and Studiologic Sledge (Basic sawtooth, 3 oscillators, 1 octave apart, no detuning or filtering). Recorded directly from the Multimix 16 USB2 with a touch of reverb.


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mosc
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Congratulations on a beautiful build. It sounds quite good in your demo. I use the Nord Modular G2 for vocodeing. I like the unintelligible quality of vocoders. Sometimes, though, I want the voice to be understandable.

A little trick you can use is to mix in the direct voice in with the output of the vocoder. I process the direct voice with a high-pass filter as I have found that all you need to add for intelligibility are the sibilances, just the high frequencies. This is ironic (I love irony) because most audio engineering writings are all about how to reduce sibilance. Smile

I have two extra controls on the vocoder patch: one control is for a cross fader between the direct voice and the vocoder output, and one control is for the frequency of the high-pass filter on the direct signal. You thus get a lot more control.

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zephyrin



Joined: Feb 15, 2012
Posts: 9
Location: Switzerland

PostPosted: Thu May 28, 2015 6:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hello

I was starting to built this vocoder too.
I wanted to know if someonne found the 0.05 uf and 0.005 uf capacitor ?

I used for the other value , mylar capacitor with 5% tolrerance.

For 0.005 % i found styroflex with 1% tolerance.

for 0.05 uf i used 2 mylar capacitor (22 nf and 27 nf ) .
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Broadwave



Joined: Feb 16, 2007
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PostPosted: Thu May 28, 2015 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I wouldn't worry too much about those caps, the standard 0.047 & 0.0047 values work fine - it's only a *tiny* shift in the frequency response, and I doubt if you would even notice it Wink
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zephyrin



Joined: Feb 15, 2012
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Location: Switzerland

PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2015 5:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

thank you AndyR1960
I have some questions about the wiring.

I have used tha japanese PDF for help me.

I think there are a misstake for the phone pot.
i see wire numer 15 and 14 on PDF but i think is number 13 and 14

i have also a question about the volume pot with stereo option what is the number of the wires ? i just see number 5 !

For the cut trace i see on the japanese PDF that there are a J connexion do you know how to connect it ?

For the tantale cap i compare with the japanese PDF and it's seem the same for me

I want also to built the ETI (powertran, ELRAD) vocoder, i m starting to rebuilt the typon for the big PCB ...


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zephyrin



Joined: Feb 15, 2012
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 2:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

there is an other trap with akita vocoder.
I wanted to used the original Transistor but i don't see that the design has been changed for using the europeans transistor. So if you want to used the japanese transistor like me you need tu swap Base and collector Pin and also put the transistor in the other way.

I have also some trouble with the signal indicator and i have try to change the 4558 by some TL072 and it seem to be better ..
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Paradigm X



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 1:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wow, Andy, that looks incredible! Amazing work.

Are you considering making any pcbs to sell?



Cheers
Ben
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zephyrin



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I have finished my Okita vocoder this is some pictures of the machine


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Paradigm X



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PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 9:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

wow, now that is a beautiful build as well. Amazing work.
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isak



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PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Andy, its amazing!
Shocked

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electrospeaker



Joined: Jun 30, 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 5:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

zephyrin wrote:
thank you AndyR1960
I want also to built the ETI (powertran, ELRAD) vocoder, i m starting to rebuilt the typon for the big PCB ...


Zephyrin, your Okita vocoder is fantastic! I'd love to hear how you made that beautiful and professional looking front panel, but actually I'm posting here because I'm in the process of building an ETI/Powertran vocoder Very Happy

All my PCBs are finished actually, but I need to redo the smaller ones (internal excitation, input amps, output amp etc.) as they were made really cheaply and of low quality at the time. Since I don't have the equipment (or any suitable place) for etching my own PCBs from the magazine article I've started to redesign the boards in Eagle (free electronics CAD software) and will have them done professionaly for very low cost instead.

However, I want to redesign the input amps to incorporate a compressor/limiter (I have owned a Roland VP-330 vocoder and remember how easily the mic input distorted). I've been suggested a dedicated IC for this (That's 4301) so it shouldn't be too hard, but as I don't have the necessary skills to redesign this myself so some help would be great to realize this project!
I could also use some help in finalizing the schematic/PCB layout I've done in Eagle so far. Although I know the basics of the software there's a little work left where a more experienced user could be of help.
In addition to the above, ordering several PCBs at once would make them even cheaper, which is why I'm looking for others interested in building the same vocoder. Interested?

It would also be great to include an "Ensemble" effect at the output stage (I really loved this in my VP-330) but haven't had any success so far in finding any suitable schematics. There is the Oakley sound SE330, but it takes up a whole 1U rack on its own. I was hoping for something smaller which would fit inside the same 19" rack enclosure as the vocoder.

In return for any help I can supply fully retouched, scanned PCB layouts from the magazine article and all the relevant info for building it.
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LFLab



Joined: Dec 17, 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Well, there's a schematic in the app note, it's called the "one knob squeezer" iirc
Pretty simple compressor.
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electrospeaker



Joined: Jun 30, 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 2:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Yes indeed.
But you'd still need some insight in order to incorporate it with the existing input amp circuitry.
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zephyrin



Joined: Feb 15, 2012
Posts: 9
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Unfortunatly my okita vocoder have some defect with the instrument input when i m playing and changing the note there some audio crunch.


I have also built the MFOS vocoder

Some pictures of the vocoder

http://img.audiofanzine.com/image.php?lang=fr&identifier=image&size=normal&module=user&userPhoto_id=267920
http://img.audiofanzine.com/image.php?lang=fr&identifier=image&size=normal&module=user&userPhoto_id=285129

http://img.audiofanzine.com/image.php?lang=fr&identifier=image&size=normal&module=user&userPhoto_id=267926

http://img.audiofanzine.com/image.php?lang=fr&identifier=image&size=normal&module=user&userPhoto_id=267924

http://img.audiofanzine.com/image.php?lang=fr&identifier=image&size=normal&module=user&userPhoto_id=267925


Some extract
internal oscillator
https://soundcloud.com/user-90411072/vocoder-mfos-ininterne

Juno alpha1
https://soundcloud.com/user-90411072/vocoder-mfos-feel-so-close-juno

https://soundcloud.com/user-90411072/vocoder-mfos-blame-juno

https://soundcloud.com/user-90411072/vocoder-mfos-blame2
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electrospeaker



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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wow! Having built two vocoders already and on your way to build the ETI you must really like vocoders Wink

As mentioned earlier I'd really like an ensemble effect (similar to the Roland VP-330 vocoder and other Roland devices) at the output stage of my ETI vocoder, and having download a PDF of the Okita vocoder I noticed that it mentions an "Option stereo chorus print circuit board space" (page 61 in the PDF) but there's no schematic or PCB layout for this (as far as I can see).

Does anyone know anything more about this specific section?
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zephyrin



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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

In fact i have also start the elektor vocoder.


i found this early, perhaps we can add this in okita vocoder:
here there are someone who clone the juno 106 chorus

http://forum.anafrog.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=14125

and here the clone of chorus of juno 60


http://forum.anafrog.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=13956&hilit=chorus+clone
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electrospeaker



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks -I hadn't heard about those Roland chorus clones before.

I believe the "ensemble" effect I loved when I had my Roland VP-330 is basically a "chorus on steroids" type effect with several BBD chips all doing their own thing, hence the wider, more lush and "fat" sound without the pitch modulation of a basic chorus unit, right?

Having discussed the subject before and understanding how hard it is to clone the VP-330 ensemble (or other similar Roland keyboards with a similar ensemble) or another DIY ensemble effect which is relatively inexpensive and fits inside the vocoder enclosure I'm wondering if it might just be easier to rip out the PCB of some kind of enseble effect pedal.
I've been suggested Behringer's CC-300 which is supposed to be a clone of the (rather expensive) Boss DC-2 Dimension-C (which in turn is a cut-down pedal version of the (even more expensive) Roland SDD-320 Dimension-D.

Alas I hear it's a poor substitute for the Boss DC-2, apparently being digital (some people claim it's analog but then again that might just be the input stage). Besides I hear it's tricky to make it work with a line signal (i.e. the vocoder), so I'll have to look elsewhere.
There's another ensemble called the Boss CE-5 Chorus Ensemble which I see is based on BBD chips (earlier versions at least) and doesn't seem to sell at such inflated prices as the DC-2.
How does it compare to the DC-2 Dimension C (and more importantly, the Roland VP-330 ensemble), and will it accept (or can easily be modified for) line-level signals?


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Paradigm X



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 4:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

electrospeaker wrote:
It would also be great to include an "Ensemble" effect at the output stage (I really loved this in my VP-330) but haven't had any success so far in finding any suitable schematics. There is the Oakley sound SE330, but it takes up a whole 1U rack on its own. I was hoping for something smaller which would fit inside the same 19" rack enclosure as the vocoder.


FWIW the ensemble part is only half a rack - theres also the 'human voice module' which combine to form a 1u rack.

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

Also Scott Stite's Dim C clone

http://www.birthofasynth.com/Scott_Stites/Pages/dimc_main.html
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electrospeaker



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2015 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Paradigm X wrote:
FWIW the ensemble part is only half a rack - theres also the 'human voice module' which combine to form a 1u rack.


I stand corrected! You're quite right about the Oakley SE330 not occupying a full 19" rack and it could probably fit inside the vocoder.
Can someone tell me approx how much it'll cost to build? I see the PCB will soon be available, but not a complete kit.

Quote:

Also Scott Stite's Dim C clone

http://www.birthofasynth.com/Scott_Stites/Pages/dimc_main.html


That indeed seems to be a very nice one, and with features not even available on the original! Surprised

Has anyone designed a PCB for it?
I see the prototypes were built using a stripboard which seems quite complex.
Also, what is the approx total cost for it? Question
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Paradigm X



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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 3:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I dont know about costs, but Oakley's uses only easy to get parts, nothing old and rare. The ensemble is back in stock now fwiw.

As its a fully supported PCB i would imagine its much easier than scott's. Ive built a few oakley bits and they all worked first time, and sound great.

Getting pots and ICs from Tayda is a good way to save costs.
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hesed



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PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi to all,

i am following this since years and after debugging here and there i found a way that solve distortion and signal/peak detector problems.

On the image attached you can find all the details.

Yellow: 500k to 100k already mentioned in this topic.

Orange: cut trace already mentioned in this topic.

Red: it should be 10k referring to okita schematics.

Green: from 47k to 10k reduce the gain sensibility so there is more space before reaching distortion

Blue: put the 1M resistor away and replace it with a 100ohm trimpot,
at the beginning i was quite surprised of that but now the signal led is working perfectly.

I still have 2 problems, maybe somebody can help me:

1: the 4053 is getting really hot (already fried one), at the moment i replace it with 3 spdt to get signal thru.

2: on the voice board the 356 has a strange behaviour, if i put it away all bands work perfectly if i put it in band 2,4,6,8,10 are "eating" the signal away, like they were inverted in phase.


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zephyrin



Joined: Feb 15, 2012
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2015 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Blue: put the 1M resistor away and replace it with a 100ohm trimpot,
at the beginning i was quite surprised of that but now the signal led is working perfectly.


Are you sure for the value ? 100ohm is very different than 1M !
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