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frijitz
Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1734
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54
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 Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 12:05 pm Post subject:
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| jnuaury wrote: | | im already making room for atleast two and assuming it utilizes a 4017 ill be making a slight modification... a switch to reset the 4017 after atleast the 6th and 8th steps if this goes into the lfo range ive got myself some synchorized sequencers |
Well, it's a bit more complicated than that, but probably doable. As it stands, the audio out is AC coupled. That's because otherwise the DC component of the signal can give you quite a bit of thumping when going through a VCA. You would just have to short the coupling caps to get into LFO/sequencer territory.
The DRM input couples to the 4017's reset lines. It resets them both. So you could use that reset path, or you could insert gates to reset them individually, if that is what you want. The outputs of the 4017's go to the tops of the sliders, so they should be pretty easy for you to tap off of.
Ian |
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neandrewthal
Joined: May 11, 2007
Posts: 672
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 12:16 pm Post subject:
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Ok, here's a dumb question. What exactly do the sliders do?
Do they adjust the levels of 10 different harmonics, or do they actually "draw" the waveform? I'm thinking of replacing them with pots and am wondering if the graphic interface of the sliders is essential.
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frijitz
Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1734
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 12:28 pm Post subject:
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| neandrewthal wrote: | | Do they adjust the levels of 10 different harmonics, or do they actually "draw" the waveform? I'm thinking of replacing them with pots and am wondering if the graphic interface of the sliders is essential. |
They draw the waveform. I think it would be fine to use pots if you want, since you will probably end up adjusting the sound more by ear than by the waveform. The main drawback, it seems to me, is the large amount of space that is needed for pots.
Ian |
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Peake
Joined: Jun 29, 2007
Posts: 1113
Location: Loss Angeles
Audio files: 3
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 1:48 pm Post subject:
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| frijitz wrote: | | Peake wrote: | I'd drop in 741s and a mylar cap in the core, but that's just me  |
Sure, why not. You're making my point. If you start with something stable you can always degrade it if you want. But not vice versa.
Moog used his excellent ears as part of his design process. He also used other musicians'. I have no argument whatever with anyone who wants to use his originals.
Ian |
Some folks take vast personal offense at such talk. Thank you for your positive attitude.
I can hear that your oscillator can approach some of the unusual waveforms in the Korg Wavestation, although without the loss of HF information in the upper registers. Should be very interesting...
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We are selling emotions, there are no emotions in a grid. -mwagener
"IC 741. Sometimes you don't want fidelity." -Small Bear Electronics Catalog |
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zthee
Joined: Feb 20, 2008
Posts: 414
Location: Stockholm
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 2:34 pm Post subject:
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I soooo need to build atleast 2!
Drawing waveform with sliders - *droool* |
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fonik
Joined: Jun 07, 2006
Posts: 3950
Location: Germany
Audio files: 23
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 2:40 pm Post subject:
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i am thinking about building a fritzynth now ... (honestly!)
the VCOs sound very nice and will certainly look super cool with the faders!
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matthias
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Tech Buddy at Random*Source |
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jeffery girlsbottom
Joined: Jun 22, 2008
Posts: 27
Location: OZ
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 3:57 pm Post subject:
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I havent built a modular, but really want to.
I guess i will buy 2 of these.
cheers |
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loss1234
Joined: Jul 24, 2007
Posts: 1536
Location: nyc
Audio files: 41
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 4:19 pm Post subject:
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Ian, do you have a picture of one of these? I mainly mean can you post a picture of how it looks with the sliders? not a big deal if you cant but i was just interested in how the controls are laid out on your panel.
for those of us without access to complicated tools or the money for Front panel express, i suppose small knobs could be used if the sliders were replaced with pots. would this make the 2nd board useless though?
this is very exciting!
is this osc that at one point you were saying would work well for FM?
(ultra stable with ultra hi freq?)
thanks!
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-------------------------------------------- check out various dan music at: http://www.myspace.com/lossnyc
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synthmonger
Joined: Nov 16, 2006
Posts: 578
Location: flada
Audio files: 3
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 4:26 pm Post subject:
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Weird! My vco is also based around sub-octaves and digital ring modulation. I posted a video of it on my youtube a while back.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttxOuEahg98
I have videos of the sub-octaves squares being mixed with the fundamental saw to produce sub-octave saws but I haven't uploaded them yet. I also found mixing the saw wave form in with sub-octave variable pulse width squares creates "chain-saw" like waveforms. |
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Photon
Joined: Mar 22, 2005
Posts: 363
Location: Boston
Audio files: 1
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 4:55 pm Post subject:
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| loss1234 wrote: | | can you post a picture of how it looks with the sliders? not a big deal if you cant but i was just interested in how the controls are laid out on your panel. |
Loss, Have a look here:
http://www.bridechamber.com/bridechamber.com/DD%20Tease.html |
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frijitz
Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1734
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 5:34 pm Post subject:
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| loss1234 wrote: | | Ian, do you have a picture of one of these? I mainly mean can you post a picture of how it looks with the sliders? not a big deal if you cant but i was just interested in how the controls are laid out on your panel. |
Right. As already mentioned, Scott's drawing of his panel is now up at bridechamber.com . The sliders are mounted to the board and the panel is mounted to the sliders.
| Quote: |
for those of us without access to complicated tools or the money for Front panel express, i suppose small knobs could be used if the sliders were replaced with pots. would this make the 2nd board useless though? |
It wouldn't make it useless. It would just be mostly empty space. The driver chips and the steering diodes are on the board, so you still need the board. I believe you might be able to chop it down to a smaller size though, since the circuitry is in the middle of the board.
| Quote: |
is this osc that at one point you were saying would work well for FM? (ultra stable with ultra hi freq?) |
I really don't remember, but it could be pretty good for that.
Ian |
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bugfight
Joined: Aug 02, 2007
Posts: 188
Location: Arlington, TX USA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 6:12 pm Post subject:
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DD Tease == Dirty, Dirty Tease... |
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bubblechamber
Joined: Nov 04, 2006
Posts: 280
Location: NYC
Audio files: 1
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jeffery girlsbottom
Joined: Jun 22, 2008
Posts: 27
Location: OZ
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 11:40 pm Post subject:
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My mate Rich gave me this link.
Fucking top job mate
cheers |
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neandrewthal
Joined: May 11, 2007
Posts: 672
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 11:55 pm Post subject:
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| frijitz wrote: | | neandrewthal wrote: | | Do they adjust the levels of 10 different harmonics, or do they actually "draw" the waveform? I'm thinking of replacing them with pots and am wondering if the graphic interface of the sliders is essential. |
They draw the waveform. I think it would be fine to use pots if you want, since you will probably end up adjusting the sound more by ear than by the waveform. The main drawback, it seems to me, is the large amount of space that is needed for pots.
Ian |
Funny, I want pots to save space. You can pack 16mm alphas pretty tight and use teensy knobs.
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mono-poly
Joined: Jul 07, 2004
Posts: 937
Location: Rotterdam, Netherlands
Audio files: 2
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 2:03 am Post subject:
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| Amazing stuff Ian! |
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frijitz
Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1734
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 3:36 am Post subject:
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| neandrewthal wrote: | | Funny, I want pots to save space. You can pack 16mm alphas pretty tight and use teensy knobs. |
True enough. But still the space between the circles is wasted. Wouldn't small sliders be a better way to save space? Or can't you get them small enough?
Ian |
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norman phay
Joined: Jun 29, 2007
Posts: 176
Location: North-East England
Audio files: 1
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 4:43 am Post subject:
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I remember the "graphic oscillator" circuit published in E&MM in the eighties, always wanted to build it up, never quit got round to it for some reason. This looks like it leaves that one in the dust, so I'm looking forward to it loads.
Those sliders with the built-in LED, I thought they had a center-detent? I was going to buy 16 for my Klee sequencer but never did B/C of that. If you can get non-detented versions then wow, that's good news for me. |
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neandrewthal
Joined: May 11, 2007
Posts: 672
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 9:22 am Post subject:
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| frijitz wrote: | | neandrewthal wrote: | | Funny, I want pots to save space. You can pack 16mm alphas pretty tight and use teensy knobs. |
True enough. But still the space between the circles is wasted. Wouldn't small sliders be a better way to save space? Or can't you get them small enough?
Ian |
That would be ideal, If I can just find a way to cut the slots. I'm trying to make it half the size of the bridechamber panel while still using 1/4" jacks and a large knob for the coarse frequency.
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frijitz
Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1734
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 10:22 am Post subject:
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| neandrewthal wrote: | | That would be ideal, If I can just find a way to cut the slots. I'm trying to make it half the size of the bridechamber panel while still using 1/4" jacks and a large knob for the coarse frequency. |
On my original unit I have black plastic sliders all epoxied together and mounted in a big rectangular hole. (Wouldn't look so hot with metal bodies, though.)
Ian |
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doctorvague
Joined: Mar 14, 2007
Posts: 281
Location: new mexico
Audio files: 2
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 5:18 pm Post subject:
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| Scott Stites wrote: | Sweet - you could drive a two phase clock driving a BBD. It just gets better and better.
An MN3X07 would get up to 5.12 ms, which would put you in some fairly decent comb filter range.
It's a magic bus..... |
I wonder if scott has had any other deas on this?
| fonik wrote: | i am thinking about building a fritzynth now ... (honestly!)
! |
I am so with you, fonik. I'm ready to build a subrack 4 of these and some customized LPG's with some quantizers with a semi-normalized FM switching between each pair of DoubleDeka's... Yum...
Ian you have outdone yourself. Your demos kick ass and really show what it will do. Am I stretching it asking for some FM demos, though?? Fellow New Mexican guy-dude-friend-pal?? 
Your 3rd demo was getting some timbres that are very close to what I've gotten from my Modcan VCDO. That's a compliment - I love that thing. I'm REALLY curious about FM'ing these considering the stability and tracking specs. 
I know I'm not the only one who has played the sliders of a graphic EQ like an instrument and used it to shape noise for example. Would there ever be any possibility of bussing the inputs to make, say 4 DoubleDeka's that all utilize the same bank of sliders? Possibly switchable from 4 to 2 pairs to single, individual control? Then you could use that primal shaping-the-clay feeling of manipulating those sliders but they could affect 4 voices at once. With the right-feeling sliders shaping 4 musical streams at once- that could be fun indeed.
So appreciative of your contributions here Ian. A great time to be alive and own a modern soldering device.
Phil
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Last edited by doctorvague on Sat Aug 30, 2008 6:41 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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fluxmonkey
Joined: Jun 24, 2005
Posts: 708
Location: cleve
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 6:25 pm Post subject:
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| frijitz wrote: | | Right. As already mentioned, Scott's drawing of his panel is now up at bridechamber.com . The sliders are mounted to the board and the panel is mounted to the sliders. |
hoping that the sliderpot mounting board is for one set of 10 sliders? rather than for a pair as shown in the bridechamber preview. or, if a pair, make that board splitable? otherwise us frac/euro guys are gonna be SOL...
b
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bugbrand
Joined: Nov 27, 2005
Posts: 846
Location: Bristol, UK
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| Posted: Sun Aug 31, 2008 5:36 am Post subject:
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Reading and thinking... (though I haven't looked too much through Bridechamber's world)
The trouble with sliders IS the panel working.
But I can see that they'd be GREAT for this project.
But people want to do their own panels in many cases, so perhaps a little mini-panel could be made to hold the sliders -- I'm thinking similar to what Uncle K did for his Klee --> basically you make your own main panel to whatever design you desire and then cut a big rectangular hole in it (without the need for too much tidiness) into which you mount the bridechamber-supplied mini-slider-panel (perhaps with mounting holes in the corners)
Just a thought.....
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a.b.o.z.
Joined: Feb 07, 2007
Posts: 351
Location: Zagreb, Croatia
Audio files: 7
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| Posted: Sun Aug 31, 2008 9:15 am Post subject:
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| bugbrand wrote: |
Just a thought..... |
great thinking. i like it. |
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frijitz
Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1734
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54
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| Posted: Sun Aug 31, 2008 11:19 am Post subject:
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| doctorvague wrote: | | Am I stretching it asking for some FM demos, though?? |
Good point. I'll try to do some FM experiments. I have a brief demo using the DRM input for bell-like sounds, but they are a bit rough (like what you usually get from an XOR modulator). The main limitation now is that I only have one DD built up (I used the old original for the four-voice sounds) so I'll need another one to do the critical test you're suggesting.
| Quote: | | Would there ever be any possibility of bussing the inputs to make, say 4 DoubleDeka's that all utilize the same bank of sliders? |
Not easily. The sliders hang right off the counter chips, so you would need to somehow insert a summing circuit in between. Or use a bank of VCAs to combine counter outputs. Quite outside the scope of the current module, but definitely something to think about.
Ian |
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