Studio monitors - what are you guys using?

lamarcph · Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 7:44 pm Post subject:

My old Quad 404 apparently died this weekend. I used it with a pair of passive 3 way 8 ohms "professional audio studio monitor". I got those in a garage sale for 40$ a pair. One is a bit blown and hiss on a certain frequency.

I took my setup for a practice at a friend house, we played a few hours, I didn't pushed the Quad to much, but that's the last time it played. We packed everything, got home and I didn't connected it until earlier this evening.

I'll bring the Quad to a "antique" audio shop we have in town and hope they will be able to repair it.

Is using this amp to monitor music in my home studio asking for trouble? Is it able to withstand the frequency made by my Nord G2, rompler and my girlfriend bass pluged directly in the mixer? I used it that way for a year and I never heard something weird or anything.

I am considering buying a pair of yamaha MSP5 to replace my setup. They will be smaller than my passive speaker and probably less bass heavy. However would they be powerful enough to compete with a 30w guitar practice amp? And are they solid enough to move them around once a week for a practice?

Thanks for the help.

elektro80 · Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 11:29 pm Post subject:

The MSP5 will do just nicely and it can play really loud. It does of course depend a bit on the room. If the room is very big you will need something a bit more powerful.

That Quad 404 is old, and those are prone to die. However, there are several places on the web that can help you out and I know several who have resurrected their 404s. I know one guy who I think said he had actually been in touch with Quad ( or some UK Quad related company ) and ordered parts and schematics. I think he even said that there now are some authorized mods around that makes it sound better than the original design.

lamarcph · Posted: Wed Jan 26, 2005 10:58 am Post subject:

I finally got a pair of msp5a on order. I didn't listen to them before ordering them, I could have, but then I don't know anything about Studio Monitor, so probably my judgement would have been misleading.

Is a equilateral triangle of 1.25 meter each side is a correct placement for those monitor?

Thanks

elektro80 · Posted: Wed Jan 26, 2005 11:01 am Post subject:

Yup, that will do just fine!

Very Happy

lamarcph · Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2005 12:34 pm Post subject:

I got the Msp5a 2 weeks ago and I am very happy with them. I would recommend then to everyone!

My refrigerator 4 meters away is now the thing that make the most noise in my rig. Those monitors don't seems to hiss at all.

elektro80 · Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2005 12:40 pm Post subject:

Grats! Those small Yamaha monitors are great. Very Happy

What about moving the fridge into the vocal booth? Shocked

f5d · Joined: Jun 11, 2006 Posts: 8 Location: Finland

I've been using Dynaudio Acoustics BM15 (passive) -monitors since February. I have a Rotel 2x220W power amplifier for them. The sound is very accurate and pleasant to listen to. I've fed the Rotel straight from motu 828 mk2's outputs but I just ordered a passive volume controller to get full sound quality. I will also switch the motu to rme fireface at some point. I have also used Mackie HR626's and Dynaudio BM5A's earlier.

mosc · Posted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 4:29 pm Post subject:

f5d, what is your reason to switch from MOTU to RME?

elektro80 · Posted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 4:35 pm Post subject:

RME is considered to beupmarket and also quite good.. but still highly affordable.
IMO the RME products are good but it all depends on if you really need the mix of features or not.
At the moment I am considering selling some boxes of vintage pro camera gear and aim for either something RME or Apogee.

Try reading this nice little article for more info about RME:
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul05/articles/rme.htm

As for MOTU gear, that is great too. the thing about the MOTU FW interfaces is that these are generally well built, they work ( and you cannot say the same about some similar products form other vendors Rolling Eyes

)

f5d · Joined: Jun 11, 2006 Posts: 8 Location: Finland

mosc · Posted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 5:33 pm Post subject:

I'm not saying RME isn't better than MOTU, but has anyone done some independent comparisons?

I know there is one very serious problem with MOTU firewire products - they don't work with all of the firewire chips. When I was having some problems with my 828MKII they told me to be sure to use a firewire interface make with the Lucent chip. I was extremely pissed hear such an absurd statement. First, Lucent doesn't make firewire chips - that business transferred to Agere Systems. Second, what total bullshit, who knows what kind of chips are in a laptop or on the mother board?

Anyway, I wouldn't recommend one of these units because of these reasons, but once they are working, they seem to be excellent.

elektro80 · Posted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 5:45 pm Post subject:

I used a Fireface 800 for a month or so while I got the MOTU resurrected. It is quite stunning. The audio quality is very good but what makes it really great are the features. See the review at soundonsound.com

f5d · Joined: Jun 11, 2006 Posts: 8 Location: Finland

The 828 mk2 works well with my mac. I have never had any problems with it but I know that the fireface has better converters so I will probably switch to it later. I haven't done side by side comparison but I have heard so many people saying (after switching to fireface) that with motu it's like listening through some kind of filter. I've heard that motu use good (but not as good as rme use) converters but the amplifier circuitry which works with the converters isn't very good. I had an RME HDSP9632 earlier and it was also very good.

paul e. · Posted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 7:48 pm Post subject:

this is off-topic from monitors but i have to say that the new apogee A/D products seem like they will be really good and quite snazzy..i just can;t find any to try out here in toronto

seraph · Posted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 11:20 pm Post subject:

Fill-Billy · Joined: Jul 25, 2006 Posts: 3 Location: South of France

The newer generation of MOTU units, such as the Traveler,

the 896HD,

and the 828MKII,

*ALL* use Asahi Kasei's converters, which are the *SAME CONVERTERS* used by Apogee, RME, and others.

Given their strong drivers and routing flexibilty, these units are pretty hard to beat for the price.

So there you go, a little to calme the RME/MOTU Wars, same stuff dudes,

I have the Traveler and my MacBook Pro, BTW, I use the MSP3 and Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro just to stay inside topic terms of this thread

mosc · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 1:21 pm Post subject:

Fill-Billy.

Thanks for the info. Yes, all of these products are fantastic.

f5d · Joined: Jun 11, 2006 Posts: 8 Location: Finland

I purchased a passive volume controller 2 months ago and the sound quality of my monitoring system improved dramatically. The digital volume control of the 828 mk2 ruins the sound when listening at low levels (about 10 bits at worst case). Now I run the 828 mk2 output at full level to m-patch 2 passive attenuator and I get full 24 bit quality at any level. The sound is now like listening to a whole new d/a or monitors. Bass goes lower and is much more dynamic. The sound is crystal clear. I suggest anybody to use a passive volume controller after the audio interface. Passive means that it doesn't affect the sound almost at all like active controllers such as mackie big knob, samson c-control, mixing desks etc.

I don't feel any need to upgrade my motu now because my bm15's sound just amazing now. Smile

Btw, altough motu 828 mk2 and rme fireface both use AKM converters, fireface use better (and more expensive) ones. The difference may not be huge but I believe there is. And the analog stages before / after the converters also make difference.

elektro80 · Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2006 4:56 pm Post subject:

Mr. f5d is quite right.
The passive vs. active volume control thingie is an issue I won´t start on here, but no matter which route you choose, keeping the monitor gain handled in the analog domain is the vital issue really. The gain should be at line level ( hot and not clipping - a decent level ) out of the DAC.

Fill-Billy · Joined: Jul 25, 2006 Posts: 3 Location: South of France

Thanks Mr, f5d
i'm going to look into this passive thingo, my buddy has Mackie big knob, (& always telling me I need one, oneday too)

But somehow I feel mud in my face because there are mods for the MOTU which makes me ask why didn't I get RME in the first place... Crying or Very sad

but as I don't have the perfect *ear*, and everything sounds quite good for my first investments, so far . . . rather save up for Dynaudio, wouldn't you?

mosc · Posted: Fri Jul 28, 2006 11:50 am Post subject:

elektro80 · Posted: Fri Jul 28, 2006 12:29 pm Post subject:

This particular issue is often completely overlooked in project studios. Very Happy

..and even in some pro ones..

This and the lack of room treatment ... major issues.

kkissinger · Posted: Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:23 pm Post subject:

I use a pair of Mackie HR824 near field monitors for mixing. In addition, I use AKG 240DF headphones and have my trusty old college stereo (A Kenwood 7200 Stereo Power Amp and 8" ported Technics Speakers).

When I first started, all I had was my stereo system and my mixes didn't transfer particularly well to other systems. I found myself having to resort to some guesswork on some of the balances, particularly the bass response -- and lost time having to go back and remix stuff.

My next step was to acquire the AKG 240DF headphones. They are designed for accomplishing mixdowns when speakers are not available and simulate an 'average listening room' (whatever that means!). Having these headphones has enabled me to mix with much more confidence. The 240DF's have a rather high impedance (600 ohms) so you need a relatively powerful amp to drive them. For example, the headphone out jack on the Mackie CR1604 has plenty of "umph" for them but a computer's sound card or a walkman type output will understate the bass a little.

Since I don't have a precisely treated room near field monitors were my only option and I went with the HR824's. My mixes have transferred very well with them. The HR824's are on stands and I have them carefully placed.

If you can't afford near field monitors or if your studio doesn't allow optimum speaker placement, you might consider the 240DFs. Though they are headphones, they are very accurate and if your mixes sound properly balanced on the 240DFs they should transfer well to other systems.

I use an M-audio passive attenuator to control the level on the HR824's and have no complaints.

Oh yes... I still use my stereo system to check mixes to see how they will sound on consumer equipment. Funny thing... the mixes transfer from the 824s and the 240DF to the stereo just fine -- however the opposite direction was always a bit dicey!

Of course, the most important piece of equipment is one's one ears. Thus, I also own a DB meter (purchased from Radio Shack). Besides using it to calibrate the balance I monitor levels -- I prefer to mix in the 80 - 90 db range. Yep, it is fun to crank 'em up once in a while but for long mixing sessions, I prefer to go easy on my ears!

lonce · Joined: Oct 15, 2006 Posts: 1 Location: singapore

Does anyone know what, if any, is the difference between the Yamaha MSP5 and the MSP5a?

Thanks!
- lonce